In the News Did They Get It Right?

Too bad the goon squad in the US won't come up with any good program...

Yes, I do believe Marvin is right. What do we have to do to get a health system in the United States? We have not seen a president in a long time that is actively working for "the people". We need to make our voice heard so traitors like Liberman can be voted out.

Regarding the comment that: "Japan where the people see doctors 3 times the rate of Americans..." The show also pointed out that patients spend very little time with their patients, and that one problem with the Japanese system is that reimbursement to Doctors is too low. Do the math: if the doctor is paid a small amount per visit, then he must see more patients. Also, the average cost of higher education in Japan is much lower than the US, so new doctors do not graduate with a mountain of debt to repay.
Of course it's silly to say that American taxpayers built the Japanese healthcare system, given how long it's been since the post-war US occupation of Japan.

I lived 10 years in Hong Kong, 2 years in Taiwan and 10 years in Canada, all universal health care system. And I've used medical system in the US while traveling. US Medical system stings beyond rotten cheese. It's not HEALTH CARE, it's money care.

When I've got a broken leg, the last thing I care is whether the system is run by Big Brother government or not. It could be run by the mobster for all I care. If it saves lives and provide good health care to all citizens, then by all means do it.

Prevention is better than cure...Most health problems are preventable....Diabetes, hypertension, stroke, cholesterol, heart attacks, and even cancer if you think in details. People has to increase their health and let big companies go bankrupt itself.

I'm a Canadian and have used the Canadian health care system repeatedly. I've had serious back surgery, plus continuing care for multiple sclerosis. I rate the system very highly, Timely care delivered at no charge aside the astronomical taxes, shouldered by all. It's not perfect but it works for me.

To the person who said that we must remove the profit motive and the private corp. You obviously have never dealt with a government agency. God help you if you are sick and must rely on government workers to heal you. Without the motivation to attract customers as in a free market you end up with workers who don't give a flying #@&k if you live or die,especially when a good percentage of the employees are hired to meet some quota not because they are passionate about health care. God help us all if Obama should get his way. By the way Obama is a card carrying commie and if you don;t believe it do a little homework.

They appropriated $638 billion for DoD for 2010 without discussion. mostly spent on Conventional Cold War contingencies that have not existed for 20 yrs. Yet the Republicans think $90 billion /yr to expand Health Insurance is historic irresponsibility. Then defend a Private Insurance business model that is simple Gangster Capitalism. Now Obama ,Reid and other Democrats bad mouth the Insurance industry ,all the while taking its money and gutting any substance from reform.

Remember regulation of the Health Insurance will be carried out by Industry insiders that are placed in government. Wake up everyone. The Gov and society at large are Dictated to by Corp Oligarchs. Big surprise
CDC head Dr Gerberding that sold us the Flu vaccine scam is now taken a top management job at MERCK.

Its all a be fix.

(please do not publuch my e-mail address).
I do agree with the statement that the Insurance companies dominate the Health care of this country. The CEO's and VP's make millions, while the average american cannot pay , and when sick denied insurance. where in the world do you see a thing like this? and what about limit on coverage?...after a certain amount you are out! As a Republican I am surprise of the lack of interest in fixing this problem. Blatantly speaking:criminal.

Taiwan's plan is less then 15 years old and is suffering from predictable cost overruns already. Is it time to back away from some of the more extravagant features to preserve its long term viability? For example, what is so wrong about having general practitioner gatekeepers for access to specialists?

Is it not preferable to have a GP with an overall view of a patient's longer term health rather than having patients dashing off to specialists, often, one presumes, on the ill founded recommendation of friends, rather than based on GPs' expertise?

There in absolutely no way that a system who's number one priority is PROFIT...can administer good quality health care to everyone equally. On paper it cannot work. The insurance industry has no place in health care. They still have auto, home and life. Don't listen to their violins, they are not going to starve. A fair and quality health care system MUST be administrated by an entity where profit is not the main objective. The comment by John on December 14th hit the bulls eye. Why is the average American so blind? Our congress is the problem. Lobbying should be made illegal. It does the average American no good any longer. It may once have had it's place but is now a joke on us. They officially call it 'petitioning' the legislature. Right! I call it bribery. Once these thieves are elected by telling us anything we want to hear, they then turn their back on us and put out their hands out to the lobbyists. Are we as a nation, ever going to wake up?

If the U.S. moves to a government-run healthcare system, it will be disastrous to the economy, just like every other government-run "social" program we offer. Thanks for the New Deal, FDR, but when you established the Social Security Act, did you have any idea that it would bankrupt our country just 50 years later? And, in 20 years, it will be gone, so what good did this "social program" actually do for more than two generations of Americans?? I've been paying into it all my life, but will I ever see of dime when I retire in 25 years? Nope. As a result of Social Security, private employers stopped offering pension plans and look what happened... people no longer stay with one employer, they hop from job to job, and cost companies thousands in turnover costs. And to boot, anyone under the age of 40 will have to fend for themselves if they ever want to retire. Government-run Healthcare will be no different. If you want to pay 35% income tax so that everyone (even the people who drop out of school, make poor choices, and wind up on welfare) will have medical coverage, then go live in Canada. I happen to like low taxes and capitalism, which are principles this country was founded upon. So rather than socializing us like the European countries we ran away from 300 years ago, why not find a real solution to the problem. Try imposing a cap on frivolous medical law suits for starters. As many as a QUARTER MILLION frivolous law suits are filed EACH YEAR in the U.S., all of which have to be defended by malpractice insurance, which directly results in medical providers having to increase their fees to cover their malpractice insurance premiums. What ever happened to going to college, getting a good job, being a good employee... and letting your EMPLOYER take care of you instead of relying on the government? Well, what else can we expect with a "Social Organizer" in the White House? Let's hope Mitt Romney can save us in the next election so that we can start running this country like a business, the way our fore fathers intended.

"Government-run health care system" is a misnomer designed to instill fear. The VA is government-run healthcare; hence the problem alluded to by Sunshine above. Instead, most proponents of reform hope for an entity that will guide payment to the providers of health care, the so-called single-payer system. Most would like to see: 1) the replacement of the profit-driven insurance industry by expanding Medicare to cover all people; and 2) the elimination of waste & fraud inherent in the present Medicare system.

A response to Sandra’s postings on January 5, 2010 .

As much as possible, I try to stay away from debating hot issues but find it difficult to stay away from issues that affect me directly or indirectly. Before I give my opinion, I will like to respond to a few posting on here.

I took my time and read every posting and found two to be quite interesting.

1. Mike

2. Sandra.

I will start with the latter first.

Sandra, said if the government run healthcare system is put in place it will be disastrous to the economy just as all other social programs and then she cited Social Security going broke in 20 years.

I want to give you the benefit doubt to be a highly educated person and as such, you should know that social security is not going broke because the government cannot manage it but rather due to many many factors of which the most to blame is the life span increase of the Average American. To solve that problem, more money has to go in the covers than is taken out but unfortunately, most of American jobs are taken out of the country by greedy CEOs so, as to maximize company frofits earning the CEO tens of millions of dollars a year sometimes as much as $100,000,000. I do not want to get into this issue for now but if all those jobs were in the United States and the CEOs did not try hiding their moneys in international banks to avoid taxes, Social Security will not go broke. Most jobs exported out of the country to china and India can be done by most Americans for a little more than what they pay the Chinese and Indians. Wait a minute don’t say it’s all odd jobs. I’m a biochemist and a company I’m working for just built a new Quality Assurance building in China . All validation work will now be done in China . What should future Scientist like myself do? Get a job in the United States then go to China to find a job??

Back to the Social Security Issue. Thank God for what FDR did. Many retired people have had a decent respectable steady income in their golden days. What do you prefer? Your money in a Social Security Trust fund or a private investment on your own-(Investing with someone like Madorf?). Can you imagine if the country had gone with President Bush’s/McCain suggestion of privatizing social security so individuals can invest which ever way the want? Imagine you were given that chance and you put your money with Madorf, you would have been broke from last year…. At least, we still have 20 years to fix social security.

Point #2.

Sandra, you mentioned that as a result of Social Security, Private employers stopped offering pension plans…. This is purely fictional on your part to make such a claim. They have stopped paying simply because of co-corporate greed. The phamaceitical company that I work for refuses to permanently hire an administrative assistant that we so badly need why, because, they don’t want to have to pay for her 401K, and offer her long term healthcare if she ever becomes sick or retire. They have therefore decided only to hire her as a contractor after sometime; they get rid of her and bring another contractor. So, to maximize profit, they treat employees as crap.

Point #3

Get your facts straight. Don’t say the principles this country was founded on is low taxes and capitalism. I suggest you go to the library of congress or check it out online and find out the reason why many men and women came to America in the seventeenth century. It was mainly for freedom or worship.

Point #4

You mentioned going to college, getting a degree and letting your employer take care of you… I have a degree in Biochemistry, I was always at the top of my class, got recognitions by the university, co-authored a publication in a Bio-medicinal journal, worn research awards from the State of New York, Astute, Perspicacious, a team player at my job yet, I have been working for two years as a temp. They don’t want to hire me permanently… Why? Back to my answer again co-corporate greed.

Comment

As a temporary employee, I had to buy insurance from United Health Care in 2008. I was feeling chest congestion so I went to see the doctor my charges went to $900 and change but the insurance paid only $250, meanwhile, I pay more than $1500 a year.

I got scared so the whole of last year, eventhough I was paying for my insurance, I was too scared to go to the hospital. ( how unbelievable- having and insurance and still not being able to go see a doctor). A couple of days later, it got so bad I had to stay home.. now remember I’m a temporary employee so, I was loosing pay. At that time, I was working on project very important to the company… The knowledge gained from this work I did means diabetic patients being able to properly read their blood glucose level.. If I had better insurance, I would have been more productive.

Sandra, you and the many anti- reformist should stop demonizing the word “socialism” If you hate it so much, then we should privatize the firefighters, police and the army. If your neighbors house is on fire and they don’t have private firefighter’s insurance, the fire fighters will not put it out… but remember as the wind blows, your house will be next… Firefighters may be able to put out the fire in your house but you will incur damage.

Conclusion

I agree with Sandra on one thing…put a cap on how much individuals can get from law suits.

I have been living in California for 15 years and have been lucky enough has not to use the health care system in place, thank god because it is a huge scam at every level.
Being from France originally, I was used to have the doctor make house calls when I was a kid.
I was also used to social security reimbursing your prescription if you were unemployed...
I went to see a specialist in Paris for back problems, after telling the front desk I did not live here anymore, they simply stated on my profile that I had private insurance( I had NO insurance at all).
After seeing the doctor in 2 occasions and 4 X-Rays, they billed my dad 50 euros!!!!!
Try that here!
If I was in the situation of going thru serious health issues, I would go back to Europe in a heart beat...

The fundamental difference between a single payer system and the American private medical insurance system is:-
1) A single payer system provides medical care to all legal citizens thru a national medical insurance number or other registration system and everyone pays the same percentage of income. ( Although the maximum income level for the premium is usually capped.) The key is it is a service based and non profit making and covers anything and everything including specialist care as needed. Most, these days, require a payment for medications, so giving a choice and options to your physician if you want to pay for the so called latest and best.
Consequently you have a national medical record, and avoid hundreds of unnecessary checks. The system assumes an actuarial number of unemployed (by choice or not!) who are non earners and cannot pay.
2) Private medical insurance in the US varies by each states law and the policy you select and its regulations/ advantages or restrictions and what you get is what the company offers you and what either your employer or you as an individual can afford. The consequence is that you have disallowable or non claimable relatively minor expenses and co pays beyond the premium. And an army of administrators whose sole objective is to find a way of rejecting claims or defending against Liability suits.
So what, well its two fold:-
1) The 15-20 % net profit before tax of insurance companies is in the premium price you pay.
2) The adminstrative costs of most American private insurance companies run at about 15-20% of premium income and investment income and so called single payers usually run at 8-10% tops internationally, many much lower and are non profit.
That amounts at a worst case basis to 20% excess cost or 20% ( best 32%) of the $2.1 trillion of GDP spent on health care in the USA and is a $429BN wost case saving!
We have not even touched how a single payer could get lower prices from the big pharma, medical equipment suppliers, or longer term paying realistic fees to doctors nurses and specialists and at the same time keeping doctors and hospitals happy by not having to worry about insane (penal damages) liabilty awards ( actual damage OK) as that equals very much and significantly less insurance premiums for doctors and Hospitals and longer term reducing costs by national individual medical records that avoid useless and actually unnecessary checks as of now.
Please note the single payer system is not interested in your religion, means abortion. You wont ask for one if your religion is opposed, or the doctor objects but it is available and covered as an individual freedom. Also your natioanality as long as you have a valid national insurance number which you cannot have without a job = green card or US passport/Valid Visa and pay the single payer Premium = illegal immigrants not an issue or = go back home for medical treatment or the doctors and nurses hypocratic oaths prevail when its a case of life or death in an emergency. But it gets you deported and black listed for re-entry, as you had no legal right to be here.
Ah but I forgot it is SOCIALISM. Nope it's called morality and religion American style!!
God bless America, pass health care with a public option provided its deficit negative.
Regards,
Hodgson.

The system IS broken, of that, there is little doubt but it is not going be to repaired. It can't be repaired because doing so is out of our control. Some time ago the people gave up their self-determination by turning over all power of choice to large corporations, by giving them a form of Super Citizenship that has a superset of rights and access and few if any responsibilities. Democracy is an illusion in the USA today, the great debates and emotions are about the limited range of choices offered by those same super-citizen corporations that must be protected at all costs by congress which has been purchased through unlimited funding of campaigns and PACs. Since the media is controlled by just 5 corporate entities, the debate, the subjects debated, the framing of the issues, and the range of choices have already been determined by the media and the corporate agenda.
Now, with the newest assault on democracy in place by the Supreme Court, giving the rights of unlimited participation in the electoral process by corporations, human citizens have lost the modest remaining ability to influence the future path the country takes.

The health industry in the US surely is a scandal but that is the way it was designed and the proposed bill only further increases the control of the money and lived of every human citizen.
I am lucky, when I needed a major operation that my US health insurance company denied coverage for I was able to go to another country an have it done. I have not used my insurance in the 10 years I had the policy, assuming I would only use it for major issues or accident. At $758 a month that worked out to be a lot of money. The only time I tried to get coverage, after only a 5 minute alloted office visit, the insurance company clerk assigned the case denied a much needed hip replacement surgery. I was told it would cost $90,000 out of pocket, which I did not have. Eventually, after a couple more years of pain I had it done in my new adopted home country. The experience was polar opposite of the US medical experience; great attention, and care, full explanations, and easy access to medical staff, a deluxe private room and spectacular results. I was walking to work 13 days after the operation, and never needed pain medication from the time I woke up from the operation up to now. Total cost including the joint that costs $12,500 alone in the US? $5700. Where would that extra $84300 gone to? In to the pockets of 50 middlemen who have nothing to do with medical services.

The US is now ungovernable, it is too polarized and corporatist to make wise and difficult decisions that are needed to overhaul every aspect of public policy. The US is falling further and further behind the rest of the developed world and even much of the developing world in education, personal debt, heath care, security, and maintenance of a middle class. Why is the country so proud of being 44th in infant mortality, or 1st in prison population, or drop out rates seen nowhere else? The middle class is dying, and quality of life is falling behind countries the US looks down on.
I am not confident that the US has the will to take back a leadership roll in anything or even find a way to prevent the complete destruction of th middle class since those jobs will never return. It will be a painful adjustment to failed empire status as the economic center of the world shifts to the east. The jobs, capital, innovation, and education advantages have already left and are in countries like China, India, Brazil, Russia etc. India and China both have a larger total number in middle class than in the US. They graduate 50 times as many engineers and 100 times as many medical doctors than the US. Even Russia has a very fast growing middle class and higher savings rate.
Take back control of the media, regulate corporations and strip them of citizenship or "person-hood". No other country allows corporations to dominate public policy the way the US does. Europe and Scandinavia which greatly exceed the quality of life of the US would never have that high quality of life if they allowed corporations to have such control, it is not compatible with a healthy democracy or middle class.

I travel to Taiwan on an annual basis. I've had 2 experiences with their health system. It is beyond belief. The complete cost is less than my co pay in the U.S.

What is beyond belief is the management. One doesn't need to make an appointment. The wait is not more than 5 minutes. The medicine is provided at the doctor's office upon completion of the exam.

At the hospital, one's prescription has been filled by the time one reaches the in-house pharmacist.

Why do I waste my time in the U.S. by waiting for 30 minutes to 2 hours to see the doctor ... WHEN I HAVE AN APPOINTMENT!?! If I'm more than 5 minutes late to a meeting, the participants either leave or glare at me upon my arrival. Why do we tolerate this from a 'Doctor' as if they are the second coming of Christ?!?

Doctors need to meet the patient's expectations ... and our expectations need to be raised.